[CQ-Contest] Remote op & Who is this guy, really?

Thu Nov 5 10:32:46 EST 2015

Gerry,

I think you miss my point to some degree.  I had tried to carefully not accuse anyone of anything or start a flame war.  I think I acknowledged inclusiveness of opinions.  Everyone has perfectly good intentions here.  For any degree that it appeared otherwise, I apologize.  I also do not mean to imply that the rules prevent any of this; as far as I know they do not and neither N6TR nor anyone else is a cheater.  Nor will any of your projects set my hair on fire.  Do as you like with my blessings, I am only offering my opinions about the direction of contesting.  I've earned the right to do that, and I think I did so respectfully.

But, I definitely do not agree with you that a non-ham can know nothing about it.  An "outsider" can provide valuable perspective, and many of us do not see this type of operation as a positive thing.  It is not silly to note their perspective, it is a way to gauge my own reaction against those with no stake in the matter, who look at aspects of a competitive sport with a neutral opinion on the technology.  Please don't dismiss their intelligence.

Noting all this publicly for discussion is very valuable.  I hope I have opened the door for others to comment who appear to have been reluctant to do so.

73,
Drew K3PA

-----Original message-----
From:Gerry Hull <gerry at yccc.org>
Sent:Thu 11-05-2015 08:38 am
Subject:Re: [CQ-Contest] Remote op & Who is this guy, really?
To:Drew Vonada-Smith <drew at whisperingwoods.org>; 
CC:cq-contest at contesting.com; 

Hi Drew,
 How can your "non-hams" even comprehend the idea?  They have no concept.  Certainly, they are entitled to use words like "it's cheating" all they want.  However, I guess contesting luminaries like
N6TR are cheaters then?  He did remote SS years ago.  At WRTC 2014, we had seven remotes operating.   Did the leading contesters in the world thing we were doing something wrong?  I don't think so.
 Show, anywhere within the rules, where this is considered cheating.  You are certainly entitled to not like it.  Many hated SSB for years.  Many lament assisted operating and the use of clusters.  Is that cheating as well?
 If you have a strong opinion, that's welcome.  Attributing words like "bogus, cheating and lost-your-way" to your "non-ham friends" is just silly.
 VY1 will remain rare, especially on CW, despite our efforts.   Our contacts will count for Contests and all awards, including DXCC.  
 Remote Amateur Radio is part of the fabric of our hobby, like it or not.  Ask those hams who are HOA restricted.
 My next project, which will happen, will probably set your (and Paul's) hair on fire.  The only constant in this world is change.
 73 and hope to work you in SS.
 Gerry W1VE
 (Art: W1SJ?  Mitch is a Phone Guy, and a good one!)

On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 11:02 AM, Drew Vonada-Smith <drew at whisperingwoods.org <mailto:drew at whisperingwoods.org> > wrote:
Friends,

 I had to take this opportunity after the comment about the end of rare sections...

 I think all this remote work, trying to help J. etc is interesting and wonderful and I really don't mean to be negative.  But...what is the point of a "rare section" if you don't have to be there to operate?  Doesn't this in many ways, miss the point of a multiplier?  

 As an analogous example, what if a DXpedition were to put up an automated station in Bouvet, and operate it from home?  Bouvet becomes common.  What have we really achieved?  HF propagation to Bouvet was never really the point, was it?

 I'm not a Luddite, I get the interest, good intentions, and technical achievement in all this.  It sounds fun!  But as a test to see if I was just narrow-minded or a fuddy-duddy, I ran this remote idea past a few non-hams who know just enough about contesting to understand.  The comments I received were:

 - That's bogus

 - That's cheating

 - You guys have lost your way

 Can't say I disagree.  Food for thought.  Not to stop such operations, progress will always move forward, but to try and recognize what it all means and establish limits.

 73,

 Drew K3PA

 -----Original message-----
 From:Art Boyars <artboyars at gmail.com <mailto:artboyars at gmail.com> >
 Sent:Wed 11-04-2015 09:21 am
 Subject:[CQ-Contest] Who is this guy, really?
 To:CQ-Contest Reflector <cq-contest at contesting.com <mailto:cq-contest at contesting.com> >;

 W1VE said:  "Thanks to a lot of work from J and the remote team, Hal, W1NN,
 will operate [VY1AAA] SOHP in November SS via remote from his home in Ohio."

 OK, so "Hal, W1NN" will operate a NT station from his home in Ohio.

 But for the past many contests "Hal" has purportedly operated "W1NN" in
 Ohio ... remotely from Japan.  (You could look it up.)

 Can we believe that "Hal" is really where he says he is, or that the
 station is where it claims to be, or even who he says he is?

 (In case I'm too subtle, that was a joke.)

 And Gerry will be (actually, physically) at K2LE in VT.  Could that be
 competition for W1SJ?

 Are we about to see the end of rare Sections in SS?  (Not a joke.)

 73, Art K3KU
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