Denis has a point about the latency issue.
Of those concerned about the issue, let me ask... how many have actually
operated a remote station?
KQ3DX set up one of his rigs (I believe his Omni VI) via remote control (an
Internet link) about, oh, not quite a year back. Came over here to
demonstrate it. It was interesting to work him, or his rig if you will,
when he was actually sitting next to me in the shack with a laptop and a
headset.
But an advantage? There was a small but noticeable delay between the time I
said something and he heard it, and vice-versa. I'd guess a touch under a
half a second... just enough to be annoying on phone, but quite noticeable
on CW. And that was in a casual QSO. In a high-speed contest situation?
I'd want to actually try it to say for certain, but I'd strongly suspect
that it would be difficult on phone and near impossible on CW -- the
operator of the remote station just couldn't come back fast enough.
Oh, I'm sure there are ways... a two way RF link for audio with control via
the Internet comes to mind, and I'm sure there are many others... but an
advantage? With current off the shelf technology? Hardly.
73, ron w3wn
-----Original Message-----
From: cq-contest-bounces@contesting.com
[mailto:cq-contest-bounces@contesting.com]On Behalf Of Dennis McAlpine
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 2:44 PM
To: 'Michael Coslo'; 'cq-contest reflector'
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Contesting using remote stations
If one reads the definition from the CQ WW rules that you so kindly
provided, I see nothing that disqualifies a remotely operated station. Just
because one has a control wire that is outside the 500 meter does not seem
to fall outside the definition since the receivers and transmitters and
antennas are all within that circle. Perhaps the ambiguity results because
the rules were not designed to encompass remotely operated stations.
Perhaps, that is also the reason that the CAC is studying this question.
As to "advantages" and "disadvantages" of remotely operated stations, do not
forget the latency, or lag, effect from the use of the internet or other
controlling medium. That delay can cause numerous problems in a contest.
Ask some of the guys who have done remotely operated contests. In addition,
ever wonder if your antenna was really pointed where the rotor indicator
says it is? If you are on site, just look out the window. But, it is tough
to do that from 20 miles, or whatever, away. I do ponder the possibility
of having switching between remotely operated receivers all over the
country but I think that might be stretching it a bit. But, maybe N6TR or
someone else will come up with a way of effectively doing just that.
As to why do we allow such travesties to develop? I recently moved to a
gated plantation in SC because that is where my wife and I decided to retire
and enjoy life. I did so knowing that it would be unlikely that I could put
up a tower and against the advice of my longtime friend, K1VR. In practice,
I have managed to put a vertical antenna in the woods behind our house, so
far without problem. It is not a beam but it does allow me to operate to
some extent. But, the big guns need not fear me and my monster signal - not
that they would anyway. My goal is to find a location, hopefully by the
ocean in a commercially zoned area and put up a tower or two. I could
access the station remotely for everyday operating and go to it to operate
contests or such. As remotely operated systems become more commonplace and
less of a curiosity, I think this will be a viable possibility. In the
meantime, I have a home in a nice area that my family all enjoys and I still
can dabble with the radio. Why, I even managed to work Ducie and Clipperton
on all bands from 160-10 meters in between numerous rounds of golf, some
acting and some walks on the beach. What more could I ask?
-----Original Message-----
From: cq-contest-bounces@contesting.com
[mailto:cq-contest-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Michael Coslo
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 1:57 PM
To: cq-contest reflector
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Contesting using remote stations
On Mar 17, 2008, at 11:58 AM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
>
>> Exactly what are the "unfair" advantages of a remote station? It
>> seems to me that there might be some significant *disadvantages* to
>> remote contest operation.
>
> The "unfair" advantages are: 1) the ability to build antennas that
> that would not be available in normal residential areas, 2) the
> ability to operate from geographically advantaged locations (e.g.,
> rare zone, country, section) without being a resident or travel,
> 3) the ability (although not legally) to use multiple receive
> locations.
>
> Equipment without an operator is not a "station." Similarly, an
> operator without equipment is not a "station" When the rules say
> that all parts of the station must be within a 500 meter circle,
> that should include the operator.
Quote from CQWW rules:
Transmitters and receivers must be
located within a 500 meter diameter circle
or within the property limits of the station
licensee's address, whichever is
greater. All antennas used by the entrant
must be physically connected by wires to
the transmitters and receivers used by the
entrant.
End quote.
Well, that certainly does disqualify remote stations, doesn't it!
;^)
I'd question whether or not there is any serious advantage at all to
a remote station. Certainly it might be a "better" location than the
Op's home QTH, but then anyone who has a good location should be
penalized. There just isn't enough real advantage to the concept,
after all, the Op can just go to the remote station, and almost
certainly operate more efficiently while there.
I think I'll allow them in PAQSO. It seems like a good technology
enticement.
-73 de Mike N3LI -
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