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[TowerTalk] Yagi torque balance

To: towertalk <towertalk@contesting.com>
Subject: [TowerTalk] Yagi torque balance
From: Steve Maki <lists@oakcom.org>
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2019 20:16:22 -0400
List-post: <mailto:towertalk@contesting.com>
K6MR was kind enough to send me an article by K5IU that sheds some light on this issue. It's not intuitive (at least for me), but when you look at his drawings of the vectors and accept the formulas, you can see that the boom does NOT go in-line with the wind even in the case of a one element yagi with the element at one end of the boom.

K5IU shows, in the course of debunking commonly accepted methods of determining wind area of a yagi, that when you have crossed tubes, the minimum wind force occurs when NONE of the tubes are either in-line with or perpendicular with the wind. It doesn't matter how the elements are distributed. Only the relative areas of the boom vs the elements. If the areas are the same, than minimum wind force occurs at 45° offset. If one or the other has more area, than it's some other angle, but always oblique from the wind direction.

By extension (my take from the article) is that if allowed to, the assembly WILL rotate to the minimum wind force position. It may be that the torque for a given wind speed is not all that great, but the torque must be there.

So it still seems to me that the assertion that yagis are automatically torque balanced just by mounting them at the boom center is not true.

I hope Dick Weber won't mind if I post a url to his article.

https://app.box.com/s/40l9icahrtlpqoyd0zppp9vdxn5ck1xc

-Steve K8LX


On 9/3/2019 10:59 AM, dj7ww@t-online.de wrote:

No, the wind aerea at the boom side with the element on is much larger then on 
the opposite side and turns the boom into the direction of the wind, always!

73
Peter




-----Original-Nachricht-----
Betreff: Re: [TowerTalk] High VSWR
Datum: 2019-09-03T14:21:19+0200
Von: "Steve Maki" <lists@oakcom.org>
An: "towertalk" <towertalk@contesting.com>

I can't wrap my head around this.

Yes, the element is "torque balanced" at it's own center, but at the
boom center? I think not.

-Steve K8LX

On 09/02/19 12:41 PM, Jim Thomson wrote:

##  vane NOT  required if boom  mounted at  center.   Counterweight  IS  
required....at  light end.
##  Longer  eles... and  number  of  eles  has  nothing to  do with with it.    
Each  ele  is  symetrical...so  the  eles  are  already tq  balanced .    If  
wind  hits the  eles  at  an angle......  and  viewed from above...  left  side 
 of  eles  bends CW.....
meanwhile right  side of  ele  bends  CCW...... they  cancel out...... or  vice 
versa.   The  eles  are  still  tq  balanced.

##  I tried  this  experiment.   40  ft  boom.....  mounted   at  exact center  
of  boom....to  mast.  Only  ONE  20m  ELE USED...THE REF..... mounted   of 
course, at extreme  end of  boom.   no  counterweight used for  this  test.   
No  coax,  no  rotor.
Does  not  rotate,  nor ....weathervane,  etc.   Stays  put,  regardless  of  
windspeed,  or  where boom  was oriented by  hand.



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