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Re: [RFI] Tesla's Response to Solar Panel RFI

To: "'Hare, Ed W1RFI'" <w1rfi@arrl.org>, "'<Rfi@contesting.com>'" <rfi@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [RFI] Tesla's Response to Solar Panel RFI
From: "Eddie Edwards" <eddieedwards@centurylink.net>
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2019 21:23:34 -0600
List-post: <mailto:rfi@contesting.com>
I completely agree with you Ed that politicians are never the answer top
anything.  They are the problem.  

Early on, these cases will be about a neighbor adding solar panels to their
house next door to a ham.  Unless solar vendors change there basic design to
eliminate RFI in all cases before installation, this will eventually
escalate to a bigger mess mostly in regions where ample sunshine allows a 10
year break even on investment when electric bills rise sharply.  I don't
think the solar vendors will change their bad design.  So eventually it will
escalate when a ham moves into a home where a neighbor has noisy solar
panels already in place for a few years, and the ham discovers this too late
after moving in.  Now he has a complaint that the vendor will not respond to
since it is not a new installation.  This is our future for HF ham radio.
This will reduce the number of hams active on HF just as HOAs have done over
the long term.  

But for right now, you are correct and that was the four steps I mentioned
that are aligned with your recommendations.  However, not all hams are ARRL
members.  And they will call the FCC immediately.  This happened on a
powerline noise case with our utility a few years ago.  ARRL was not
involved since the ham contacted the FCC office directly and the FCC
immediately sent a letter to the utility which I think ARRL web site has a
copy of on it's RFI enforcement web page.  There will be plenty of these
complaints to the FCC bypassing ARRL as this solar mess rolls out.  

73, de ed -K0iL

-----Original Message-----
From: RFI <rfi-bounces+eddieedwards=centurylink.net@contesting.com> On
Behalf Of Hare, Ed W1RFI
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2019 14:54
To: '<Rfi@contesting.com>' <rfi@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [RFI] Tesla's Response to Solar Panel RFI

If you contact the FCC, it will probably send the case directly to ARRL.
Not many years ago, the FCC did essentially nothing in response to
complaints, stating that it didn't have the staff resources to deal with
individual complaints. Beginning with Riley Hollingsworth, both Riley and
ARRL managed to open that door a lot more widely, but with the provision
that ARRL would try to work with hams to resolve problems before asking for
FCC help.  This involves first assessing whether the reported noise is
harmful interference as defined by FCC rules.  It is then necessary to
ensure that the noise source has been correctly identified.  FCC then wants
the ham to try to resolve it first, usually by directly working with a
neighbor, utility, company, etc.  As each of those steps unfolds, ARRL
documents these efforts to resolve problem.  Then, if the parties involved
do not act responsibly, FCC can and does send an advisory letter to try to
facilitate resolution.

Politicians are not the answer. To them, this is a matter of pitting a hobby
against big business or the general public. Amateur Radio will not come out
looking good if it opens that can of worms.

Congress is probably not going enact an Act that changes Part 15, so the
matter will be up to the FCC.  FCC is not going to change the limits or
place any licensed service underneath an unintentional emitter, and if we
continue to work reasonably with what seems to be a generally cooperative
industry, it is not likely that any solar company or utility will ask them

I think we are on the best possible track and ARRL staff in the Lab will
continue to work with hams, Solar Edge, Tesla and the FCC, both globally and
on individual cases.

Ed Hare, W1RFI

-----Original Message-----
From: RFI <rfi-bounces@contesting.com> On Behalf Of Eddie Edwards
Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2019 7:55 PM
To: '<Rfi@contesting.com>' <rfi@contesting.com>; 'Stan Zawrotny'
Subject: Re: [RFI] Tesla's Response to Solar Panel RFI

I totally agree with Stan's assessment, and would recommend all hams who
operate HF and VHF bands begin contacting the ARRL and the FCC immediately
regarding this issue whether you have solar RFI today or not.  

This issue will only grow worse with time and we'll soon all have this
problem next door as politicians continue to move utilities away from fossil
fuels and towards expensive renewables like wind & solar power eventually
making the cheap, noisy home solar power more affordable to lower
electricity bills.  

We can't hope for a weakness in solar power technology like BPL had with
WiFi technology obsoleting house-wired BPL.  All it will take for solar to
win in courts is for politicians to change the FCC Part 15 in favor of the
home solar systems and companies that make and sell them.  We need political
activism now not judicial court actions taking years doing nothing. 

1. If not already a member, put aside your politics and join ARRL.  It will
take a large organization with a large membership to take on this battle.  
2. Contact your ARRL section manager and regional directors about the
problem and your expectations of ARRL actions. 
3. Contact the FCC in writing complaining about solar power system companies
ignoring FCC regulations and complaints by license radio services. 
4. Any other ideas out there?  Please share them here and on and club email
or facebook groups.   

I can see this issue eventually forcing amateur operators to add full power
amps to their stations so they can be heard by hams suffering from solar
RFI.  So it might be viewed reasonable for ARRL to submit a request to the
FCC to increase the legal maximum power output for Amateur Radio stations.
I'm not proposing this as an actual solution, but as a desperate measure in
response to the FCC's failure to act appropriately to resolve the problem.  

Geez, with HOAs reducing the number of licensed operators on HF and now
this, HF operation could become a thing of the past if we lose this battle
in the long run.  

73, de ed -K0iL
Ed Edwards
Omaha, NE

-----Original Message-----
From: RFI <rfi-bounces@contesting.com> On Behalf Of Stan Zawrotny
Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2019 17:00

Our "class action" vehicle, as was already pointed out, is the ARRL. As part
of their charter to protect our spectrum and represent their members in all
aspects of the hobby, they need to step up to the plate and take charge of
the Solar RFI problem. They, in turn, need  to (1) contact offending
companies, and (2) pressure the FCC to become aware of the entire noise
level problem and start enforcing their rules.

Stan, K4SBZ

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