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Re: [CQ-Contest] Cheating

To: David Gilbert <xdavid@cis-broadband.com>, <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Cheating
From: <ve4xt@mymts.net>
Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 08:31:04 -0500
List-post: <cq-contest@contesting.com">mailto:cq-contest@contesting.com>
Where's the willingness?
I'll tell you where: it's wrapped up in laws surrounding libel and slander.

You need rock solid evidence to go public, and if you get sued, YOU have to
prove that what you said was true. The plaintiff is under zero obligation to
prove that it's not true. It's called reverse onus, and it applies in most
countries that have laws against libel and slander.

So unless you have personally taken leakproof measurements, either at the
output of the amp or near-field field-strength, you're opening up a hornet's
nest that could bankrupt you.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I didn't enter ham radio to go

73, kelly

On 10/14/11 11:23 PM, "David Gilbert" <xdavid@cis-broadband.com> wrote:

> Actually, Hans, that's pretty much the attitude I was trying to combat
> when I wrote my original post about the ad for the 8K-Ultra.  I really
> wasn't trying to focus attention on the hardware side of things ... not
> big amplifiers and not physical means of catching cheaters.  Personally,
> I don't think there is a practical solution to the problem from that end.
> Instead, what bothered me greatly was that power cheating had become so
> blatant that a nationally known vendor like RadioDan (W7RF) would
> publicly advocate the running of illegal power to gain a competitive
> edge in a contest.  As I've asked before, where's the universal
> condemnation of those who cheat?  They get a delisting in the contest
> results and that's pretty much it.  That's all the contest sponsor can
> do but what about the rest of us?  Where's the willingness to publicly
> speak out about cheaters based upon first hand knowledge?  As another
> poster here commented, people who reluctantly point a finger are more
> likely to be ignored because it is an uncomfortable topic, or worse,
> more likely to be condemned than the person they point the finger at.
> And while you may not have first hand knowledge of anyone who has
> cheated, I've listened to literally dozens of stories from people who
> claimed to have first hand knowledge of someone chronically cheating.
> So yeah, lets just keep pretending it's a "small number" of violators
> and ignore the issue some more, or pretend that the contest sponsors
> have the burden and the means to solely address the issue while we get
> back to other, less contentious topics.
> Until we, the contesting community, accept some measure of
> responsibility for policing our own ranks and applying peer pressure to
> rule violators we totally get what we deserve.  Being a contest sponsor
> must be a ridiculously thankless task ....
> Dave   AB7E
> On 10/14/2011 6:57 PM, Radio K0HB wrote:
>> Tony, you've neatly summarized the situation.
>> I'm sure that there is some very small number of cheaters out there.  I've
>> been hamming 50 years and contesting at some level for most of those years,
>> and I've never met one that I even SUSPECT, let alone could accuse in good
>> conscience, but like I said, I'm sure that there might be some small number
>> of them out there.
>> So let's make a deal here, people.  If you know one and have persuasive
>> evidence, turn the sucker in to the contest sponsor.
>> Now then, let's turn this back into a reflector where I can learn new
>> contesting skills.  Take your cheating jeremiads to
>> CQ-Contest-CHEATERS@yahoogroups.com  (yes, there is such a reflector).
>> 73, de Hans, K0HB
>> "Just a Boy and his Radio"
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Tony Rogozinski
>> Bottom line is that there is no solution - let them enjoy their shallow
>> victories and if you can prove it let the world know
>> in no uncertain terms who they are.  Those of you who can be included in the
>> group that I'm referring to may think
>> about it a little and consider the value of being dishonest - you're no
>> better than common criminals.
>> Tony
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